framing question

[kathleenc]

The person I hired to redo my framing (from the bottom up - complete rebuild) is intending to use large staples on the framing. When I suggested the Kreg method, he said the staples would be better because it would allow the frame to flex while on the road.
I would love feedback from you guys on this. Thanks!

[Gone Kayaking]

I would push a bit harder on him. That is certainly the way they were constructed to begin with, and it did hold up. But I think the fact that the skin is attached to the frame with all the windows, and through the skin at a number of places offsets that flex argument. I asked this question back when i was starting my rebuild and many of the members here convinced me that stiff and sturdy beats flexible and weak.
Another clear advantage for your guy doing it is that it is certainly much much faster. If he's a hard worker and you decide to go this route it will save you some money, but you should make sure he knows that you know that it will likely take him half the time (or less) and you will compensate accordingly. Labor is the most expensive part of doing a rebuild obviously.

[dawgpound]

You really don't want any trailer to flex much. Flexing will result in weaker joints in the long run. Thus resulting in having leaks.

I personally don't use nails or staples when rebuilding vintage trailers. I always use pocket screws (Kreg) and glue.

You are the one paying for the work, you should get it done the way you want it done. Gone Kayaking is correct, it will cost more in labor to use the pocket screw method, then your guy using staples or nails.

Just my 2 cents.

[kathleenc]

thanks. I would rather pay more for a sturdier trailer, but wanted to make sure that it was actually a good thing! You know, when you don't know much about something, and someone says something that sounds logical (like the flex thing), it's good to get more opinions, and I'm glad I did.

[cowcharge]

I agree, screws are better. If the frame manages to flex around stapled areas (unlikely as GK said, because there are so many more attachments through the skin, cabinets etc., that all stapling does is weaken the supporting structure for the skin), it puts stress on the more rigid screwed elements, like the j-rails, making for leaks.

They don't have to be all pocket screws either, no reason he couldn't screw through from the outside into the ends of studs and such if the frames are being totally rebuilt off the trailer. The pocket screws are really only needed in places that are tough to get to, like when you don't do a complete teardown and you need to put one piece in and can't get to the other side to drill through. A longer screw driven in from the other direction into the end grain is stronger, because drilling a pocket screw hole leaves you less wood to bite into.

The materials cost will go up some too, because screws cost more than staples.

[schweetcruisers]

umm, does he not realize that when he puts the wood skin and the aluminum skin on it stiffens up, considerably. It sound like he wants to do a quick job not a quality job.

[universalexports]

I have to agree, with every flex the staple and wood are moving, over time it will wear and flex more and more, sure it worked when they were made, but I would guess that is because it was cheaper and faster. not better.

[joecamper]

To those who have yet to buy a trlr

I have come to the conclusion that the 3/4 in framing that the Shastas are built with is a structural flaw, and a big one. Specificly on the roof members

One that is not overcome simply by replacing the old with new.

Take a 7ft piece of 1by all by itself and support it on both ends and take a straight edge to it. It aint pretty.

Then this piece of wood that cant even stand proud on its own at 7 ft length is also going to support the inner and outer panels and do this bouncing down the road??

Very disapointing to find this out about Shasta.

Only thing I can suggest is when buying the framing pieces you better pick the most crowned pieces you can find for these members. That or pick a trlr that is framed in 2by instead.

[joecamper]

Im no master craftsman but judging by the other builds Ive seen here wedo have them participating here.

You could not convince me that those who are have not come to the same conclusion and worry just a bit about it as I do.

Dosnt seem to be affecting their popularity much so I suppose thats good

[joecamper]

They put a metal strip 3/4 by1/8 and drilled holes and saddled it up to 1 of the 2 roof vent studs for added strength. The screws were in bigger than correct holes sloppy and not even tight the entire attempt was self defeating.

[joecamper]

There are 3 critical ceiling studs on an Airflyte the 2 for the roof vent but the one in the rear where the radius above the window meets the next panel forward. The center stud on that panel needs help. IMO A real bowed 1 is about the only reasonable solution.

Or save that stud for last one. and cut it a bit long and bow it in crowning out just a bit. Just thought of that right as I composed this I may try that tomorrow on the airflyte Im doing.

Could do that for the 2 roof vent studs too.

Now that I have the entire thing reframed its solid enough for me to be able to put some crown on those 3 members by doing them last then cutting them a bit long and bowing them in.

Could combine this idea with a 1in by 1/8in aluminum strap 7ft right next to that stud Im wanting longer to keep it from from pushing on the outside walls over time.


Anybody ever try this?

[joecamper]

I broke down and bought a pocket screw jig for my project and there really is only 1 or 2 blind corners that you really need it and can easily work around not having it